User talk:Harakoni

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Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

I noticed that all leather amounts are of. Could you add a property for them like Property:Meat Yield? They are calculated by pretty much the same formula:

40*bodysize, with the following post-process curve:

(0,0) (5,14) (40,40) (100000,100000)

The following creatures have a different base value though:

Chicken = 0; Duck = 0; Goose = 36; Megascarab = 0; Spelopede = 0; Megaspider = 0; Human = 75

Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

oh, I just noticed Property:Leather Yield already exists. In the infoboxes the values are wrong however. I think I have to remove the old definitions.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

I can set it up so that it automatically interpolates the value from the body size, and then you can manually override that with the template. Do you happen to know a few of the correct leather amounts for the animals you've removed so I can test it?

Cheldra (talkcontribs)

Here's all of them (automatically scraped & calculated):

Megasloth: 160, Thrumbo: 160, Elephant: 160, Rhinoceros: 120, Cow: 96, Muffalo: 96, Bison: 96, Horse: 96, Grizzly bear: 86, Polar bear: 86, Dromedary: 84, Elk: 84, Yak: 84, Boomalope: 80, Pig: 68, Donkey: 56, Warg: 56, Deer: 48, Alpaca: 40, Ostrich: 40, Caribou: 40, Ibex: 40, Cougar: 40, Panther: 40, Wild boar: 36, Timber wolf: 36, Arctic wolf: 36, Husky: 36, Goat: 33, Sheep: 33, Capybara: 33, Labrador retriever: 33, Gazelle: 31, Turkey: 28, Emu: 28, Cassowary: 28, Lynx: 28, Fennec fox: 27, Red fox: 27, Arctic fox: 27, Goose: 26, Tortoise: 25, Alphabeaver: 24, Raccoon: 22, Iguana: 22, Chinchilla: 21, Monkey: 21, Cat: 20, Yorkshire terrier: 20, Cobra: 18, Hare: 16, Snowhare: 16, Squirrel: 16, Rat: 16, Boomrat: 16, Guinea pig: 16, Chicken: 0, Duck: 0

Also, in case it's helpful, here's an adaption of the interpolator I used on Template:Animals/Row for the baby meat yield, as it has the same post-processing curve as leather yield:

{{#vardefine:pre_curve_leather_yield
 | {{#switch: {{{name|}}}
   | Goose = {{#expr:36*{{{bodysize|}}}}}
   | Chicken | Duck | Spelopede | Megaspider = 0
   | #default = {{#expr:40*{{{bodysize|}}}}}
  }}
}}

{{#vardefine:leather_yield
 | {{#ifexpr: {{#var:pre_curve_leather_yield}} > 40
   | {{#var:pre_curve_leather_yield}}
   | {{#ifexpr: {{#var:pre_curve_leather_yield}} > 5
     | {{#expr: (40-14)/(40-5)*{{#var:pre_curve_leather_yield}} + (40 - (40-14)/(40-5)*40)}}
     | {{#expr: 14/5*{{#var:pre_curve_leather_yield}}}}
    }}
  }}
}}
Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Thanks Cheldra, but I'm confused because many of those values are the same as what was removed as outdated. Who is wrong here?

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Oh and thank you for the code snippet, that is very much appreciated.

Cheldra (talkcontribs)

I think all of the leather below 40 were incorrect until a few weeks ago, but then I fixed a few of them such as Squirrel as I spotted the mistakes. It looks like I missed a few though, since Gazelle's was still incorrect at 26, wheras the interpolation (and the in-game reported value that I just double-checked) is 31, so it was correct to have been removed.

All the leather yield values above 40, such as Deer, are unaffected by the post-processing curve, and so were already correct and did not need to be removed.

Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

Sorry got interrupted. Yes, the values above 40 were mostly correct. I removed them anyway because otherwise they wouldn't get updated in case the body size gets changed. So not the value itself was necessarily outdated but rather the way it was defined. If you don't mind I will continue remove it for all animals.

Anyway, as Cheldra noted the values for animals with leather yield below 40 are still wrong. I had a quick look at Template:Infobox main and it looks like meat yield is also not calculated properly.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Ah that's fine then, that was basically my plan - have it automatically calculate for most animals and then have leather yield be available to override the calc for things like Goose. Just the edit summary that was tripping me up. Please go ahead, and let me know if you have any troubles. I do ask that you double check any changes you make to infobox main, just because its used everywhere but I reckon you've got a handle on it.

Thanks to you both.

Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

I'll be extra careful :)

Cheldra (talkcontribs)

I've added in the leather interpolator to Template:Infobox main, and I'm pretty sure it didn't break anything :)

I'll do the same for meat yield now.

edit: done meat yield too, I think both should be calculated correctly now! (though exceptions like geese still have to be set manually)

Referenced values showing up as red links

4
Cheldra (talkcontribs)

I don't suppose you know why certain #show values act as hyperlinks? E.g. on Labrador retriever, {{#show:Labrador retriever|?Average Offspring Per Birth}} displays as 1.937.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Its because the property's type either is defined as a page (so its trying to link to the page 1.937, which obviously doesn't exist) or it has no type defined (incl. if the page for the property isn't even created), in which case it defaults to page.

In can be fixed by adding [[has type::number]] to the property page in question. In your case Property:Average Offspring Per Birth. For other things it might be has type::text, or page or email or date or URL etc. In 99.9% of cases though its going to be text, number, or page.

I'll add the relevant types to the property pages now, but this way you'll know if it ever comes up again.

I'm also going to delete Template:Dog comparison table. That cool?

Cheldra (talkcontribs)

Thank you! That's all perfect :)

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Happy to help. If there's nothing else would you mind marking this as resolved? This talk page is getting crowded and it helps to keep track. Feel free to make another topic if you need to

ItsNotReallyEditing (talkcontribs)

Looks like Jakek created another alt. He is asking me to compete in editing.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Dealt with. I could have overlooked him using alts if he didn't do the exact same things that got him banned last time. Ty for bringing it to my attention.

ItsNotReallyEditing (talkcontribs)

Sorry to bother you, but I was looking through the recent changes log to see if there was something I could edit, when I saw the user Regularity create an interesting pastebin in their user page containing some mod recommendations with some slightly NSFW language (sections 1007a and 1008). Does the wiki have any rules?

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Regularity is using it to replace the mod list pages that the wiki has tried and failed to maintain in the past. Users do have fairly free rein in their user spaces, though obviously common sense applies. We can't host totally inappropriate language/content etc. because ultimately this is Ludeon's wiki.

Mentioning RJW as an existing mod is fine afaic, being explicit about whats in it might not be depending on how detailed it gets. I'd prefer if it drew less explicit attention to the more controversial aspects of the mod, but its also probably not worth stepping in with the mod-hammer as it currently stands. If you want, feel free to politely address it with them on their talk page.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Actually I did make it slightly less explicit, just to avoid getting the wiki in trouble. If they have an issue with it, we can talk about it, but I'd rather not risk it.

Leathers are missing Property:Kind

6
Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

And another one :)

All leathers are missing the Property:Kind. I need to access that for my template mentioned below. I am willing to add it to all pages but I am not entirely sure how. Do I need to add "| category = leathery" to the infobox main? I am uncertain because there is also Property:Category. Also I don't really understand the difference to Property:Type and Property:Type2, since Bluefur for example has "Type | Textile – Leather" in the infobox but type is not defined anywhere.

There is a similar issue with wood. It has Property:Kind defined but the check for "woody" fails. I am guessing this is because it has also "Weapon" as a Property:Kind. Adding a special check for it is no problem but I wondered if there is a more permanent solution.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Hmm all of that is things I've "inherited" - I've done my best to improve the infrastructure but a lot of its built on what existed prior.

Kind in particular is annoying - its only really used for weapons and stuff types despite nominally being applicable to everything. Which is frustrating because one of the few overlaps that do exist is in weapons and stuff - Wood. How would you feel instead about my giving materials a specific Property just for the Stuff Category rather than continuing the use of Kind? Like would just be Property: Stuff Category or something similar.

As for Type is partially representation of how items are sorted in game, but as that system has been updated and changed is now only a rough approximation for it. Mostly its now just a way to link similar things into user accessible categories. Ideally it'd be reformed but its very low on the list.

Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

A special property sounds certainly like the best solution. If you set it up I can add it to all material pages (or is it done automatically?).

Thanks for the explanation. I am using Type to check whether an item is sellable and which crafting skill is required and to determine the sell price multiplier. Very tedious, since I couldn't find another property to simplify this.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Ok so Property: Stuff Category should be set and everything properly tagged. Let me know if theres any mistakes.


Also wrt Crafting skill I've been tossing up to just having it on every page even when theres no minimum skill. It would require no extra infrastructure. The only issue is that its misleading in some cases. Theres what making it gives XP too, the stats that actually control its crafting speed etc. The infobox is getting too long as it is.

Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

Wow, that was quick! I immediately used it yesterday and it made a lot of things way simpler. Didn't have time to thank you immediately unfortunately.

I don't really understand what you mean with "Theres what making it gives XP too, the stats that actually control its crafting speed etc". Why would it be misleading? I agree that the infobox shouldn't be arbitrarily long.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Wrt. skill, for example making Components requires Crafting 8, and gives you crafting XP. But having crafting 10 doesn't make you any better at making components. You're not faster because it uses General Labor Speed (iirc) and you're not better because components have no quality.

Now picture something that has no minimum skill but is also quality-less and also depends on a non-skill derived stat. Yes, crafting that thing might give you Crafting XP but thats its only connection to the Crafting skill. Will it be confusing to a new player? Will they think they should put their best crafter on it because it uses the crafting skill? And thats just one example. But now I'm just monologuing/ranting. Future/idiot/newb proofing is hard. This isn't your problem.

Extension for Template:Ingredient List

6
Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

Hi Harakoni, I spent some time creating the templates Template:Trading Value Table and Template:Trading Value Table Row]]. You can see it in action here: User:Ickputzdirwech/Steel. I've never done something like this before, so it was quite some work to build it from the ground up, but I am now fairly satisfied with the result. I started because I wanted to know which items I should craft and sell to traders (hence the name of the template) but I quickly realized that I created an extended version for Template:Ingredient List. Now I would be happy to get some feedback. What do you think? Is it suitable for the normal pages? Are there any ways to improve it? Also it takes about 30 seconds to load a page that refers to the template. How can I improve it? Or is it just because it is in the user name space?

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

First: the delay is due to the number of template calls and expressions you're performing. You can improve it - for example, right now you're running every single stuffable item through your create row test. 126 items is going to take up a fair amount of processor time even if its only running through that small section. Ideally you'd limit your initial ask to only things with the relevant tag. For example, if it were attempting to find things that use wood as their stuff {{#ask: [[Stuff Tags::~*Woody*]] }} would return only things with Woody somewhere in the stuff tags, and you'd thus not have to sort through every stuffable item - you'd only get ones with the woody in the first place.

You can also define variables instead of repeating use of Template:Q or just pull them straight from the ask instead like you already do with ?Name and ?Type but I'm not sure how much of a difference that'd make. I'd have to go through your specific code structure.

As it is, its definitely useful but I personally would have put on a dedicated page for trade good production where 1) you only have to explain the specific limitations in the calculation once 2) where you can make direct comparisons with other materials and their profitability 3) where the processing time impact is the lowest 4) you can cut out the unsellables and trim down the table size/processing time without a care. But we could totally put it in a collapsible and replace ingredients list, especially if we can improve the time issue. It does pretty much the same job.

Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

I was looking for something like {{#ask: [[Stuff Tags::~*Woody*]] }} for ages. Thanks a lot! I will definitely use it. I also tried to reduce the Template:Q calls already but I will try to minimize them even further. I also noticed that it sometimes loads way faster. Could it be that it caches a lot of stuff and only evaluates the whole thing if the page or template got edited?

The issue with creating an extra page for the tables is that the template has to be on a page with PAGENAME or SUBPAGENAME of the material. Reason being, I need the name of the material in Template:Trading Value Table Row and I couldn't find a way to pass it through the #ask function, so I just access SUBPAGENAME instead. If you know how this is possible I would be very grateful.

You are of course right that the table is not that self explanatory right now. I will try to make it more comprehensible and then we can decide where to put it.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Haha should have added nowiki tags on that I think. But if get what you meant. Glad I could help

Also remember that the page is given the vars you define, not the templates. If you vardefine name as wood, and then call a template that looks for a var called name it will find it, even if it's not in the template itself.

I'm other words you can define a var in trading value table and call it in trading table row so long as when the templates are assembled the definition comes first. I.e. definite it before the ask

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Also I suggest having an override for the page name now that you know you can pass it through the templates without having to check the subpagename again.

Not only does it allow you to put different versions of the table on the same page, you can put an example in your template doc and it makes testing a lot easier.

Just something like {{#vardefine:name | {{{ 1 | {{PAGENAME}}}}} }}

Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

Oups, added the nowiki tags. :D

The simplest solution didn't came to mind. Always nice to learn something new. This allowed me to simplify the code quite a bit and it's now possible to put the table on any page you want. Thanks again for all the advice!

How to delete a user page

3
Summary by Ickputzdirwech

Solution: Template:Delete.

Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

Hi, I got several question. I will create separate topics for each of them to avoid confusion.

This one is quite simple: How do I delete a user page of mine? I created User:Ickputzdirwech/Trading Value Table Row once but I don't need it.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

A moderator (e.g. Me) or administrator (e.g. Zesty) will have to delete it. Just tag the page with Template: Delete and I'll get around to it asap - if you do it on one of your own user pages, I'll know its fine to delete anyway, but best practice is to add a reason for deletion just in case.

Also I'm fine with individual topics for each question or a single one for protracted discussion - which ever is more comfortable for you. If you do multiple, I only ask that you resolve them when you're done with it though.

Ickputzdirwech (talkcontribs)

Thanks for the quick answer! Will do :)

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

Hello Harakoni

I would like to use more the Template:Quote, but if it can be good to have a large font size at the top of pages, it is not desirable in the middle of articles, like on Gastro-analyzer#Notes.

In many places, the "indent" method is used (like on Events#Ambrosia sprout) and it is really not the thing to do, as it is meant for code and words are often cut in the middle at the end of the line. A smaller sized quotation template would be useful in cases like this.

I don't know why it is so big on Rimworldwiki compared to Wikipedia, there is maybe different CSS rules, but I don't know much about it.

By the way, I tried to copy the Wikipedia template blockquote, but I couldn't make better than Rimworldwiki's Template:Quote, so I guess that Template:Blockquote, Template:Blockquote/doc and Template:Blockquote/styles.css can be deleted (sorry for that mess...).

I think that Template:Quote can be modified a little so a font size parameter be added.

It quess that adding style="font-size:{{{size|}}}"; to the <blockquote> tag would do the trick, but I'm not sure because this template is using unamed parameters, so maybe it could be parameter 4? (I suck when it comes to this HTML part of wikicode, so I don't know how to write the code for this).

The template would have the same behaviour, so no changes would have to be made where it is already used, but adding size=14px would make quotes the same size as the rest of the article's text.

Also, it would be good to add &nbsp: after the em dash ("—", in front of the author's name).

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Alright so the template was already set up to also take named parameters, but just undocumented. I've added a size option both unnamed and named and amended the documentation to reflect the current state of it. I also blatantly stole your documentation formatting because it looked so much better than what was currently there. (We should get around to standardizing template documentation but its way down the list)

I absolutely agree that the indent method is not ideal, its just a work around that should be discarded now that Quote is more flexible. Have a play around with the current version and sizes and see what you think works best. Let me know if there's any formatting options or changes you think may be necessary. Also let me know if the current parameter names are fine, its a simple change to add new alternatives/change existing ones. Author is likely more intuitive than "sign" and "cite" but that's what was already there.

I'll leave Blockquote and its associated pages up for now, just in case there is any content/ideas that should be taken from it, or experimentation to be done and then delete them once after you're happy.

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

Nice job.

But I'm unsure of the "sign" parameter name: I think it is better to stay as close as possible to Wikipedia's "author", so contributors that are also on Wikipedia won't be surprised, and people that don't won't see the difference anyway.

Giving the alternate names of the parameters isn't helpful too, it's always better to keep things simple ("idiotproof" ;p ).

On reflexion, maybe it would be better to make a "normal" size for quotes (i.e. not having to specify a smaller size), as in most cases it should be the right size to use in the middle of articles, and allow a bigger size for quotes at the top of pages ?

14 px looks to be fine, it would be the same size as in the "indent" trick (I edited Events#Ambrosia sprout like this). Tell me what you think ?

There is only a handful of places where the template is used at the moment, so the changes won't be too long to make.

By the way, do you know if a "database dump" of this wiki exists? It would be handy for tasks like this. On the other hand, there are only 1297 pages in the "main"), so doing them all in semi-automatic edition with AWB isn't that hard.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Tbph I kept the current substitutions options because I didn't want to bother redoing it, testing it, and then changing over the existing implementation, but if you feel it'll transfer easier, I'll do it next time I'm at a PC and free to edit.

Wrt. normal size, as in set it to size 14 by default (i.e. when no size parameter is entered) and use the size parameter for larger page toppers? Yeah thats doable. I can do that at the same time as the above. I think I might also implement a "Large" and "small" default size so that we don't end up with a bunch of little variations and it can be mass updated with one edit. SO you can say size=large or size=small or size=16 if you want to manually set it. I'll set small to 14 and large to whatever it is currently, unless you have some other opinions on it.

The Event page looks great. Much better than what it was. This was a good idea. My only addition would be having the source say something like "event card description" or something just to more plainly express that its a straight copy and paste from the notification.

As for a database dump, you're probably best asking our wonderful administrator User:Zesty on that front, either on the wiki or on the Wiki's discord. The second is probably more likely to get a response though it'll still probably take a day or two. I mostly just use the WhatLinksHere when checking stuff like that. Not the most efficient but it works fine for small jobs like this.

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

14 px and "large" seem fine to me, changes can be made after by only modifying the template anyway.

Maybe the best is to have no parameter for 14 px, and a large= parameter that makes the bigger size if it is filled with anything (e.g. large=yes), with a size= parameter on the side, that is not supposed to be used in the Main.

I made tests and the "standard" size seems to be 17.5 px (?!), it is probably handled by CSS settings, but I don't know where to look nor how to fiddle with this anyway.

Concerning the dump, it doesn't seem to be possible.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Ok so large parameter is implement as you describe. Default size is now 14px. Size parameter is maintained but noted as preferred to not be used. Existing examples on pages have been updated

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

It looks great.

I was going to edit the transclusions of the template, but I see that you've already done it. Good job!

I'll try to find some time to implement this template in the places where it should be used.

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

I noticed problems with the template:

1. The external links don't show if the parameter isn't specified:

{{quote|Gastro-analyzer is an implant INTO the nose, while aesthetic nose REPLACES the nose. You can't install a gastro analyzer into a aesthetic nose; it's one or the other.|Tynan Sylvester|"[https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=51123.msg474313#msg474313 Cannot replace destroyed gastro-analyzer]" on ''Ludeon forums''.</ref>}}

produces:

Gastro-analyzer is an implant INTO the nose, while aesthetic nose REPLACES the nose. You can't install a gastro analyzer into a aesthetic nose; it's one or the other.

— Tynan Sylvester
{{quote|Gastro-analyzer is an implant INTO the nose, while aesthetic nose REPLACES the nose. You can't install a gastro analyzer into a aesthetic nose; it's one or the other.|Tynan Sylvester|source="[https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic=51123.msg474313#msg474313 Cannot replace destroyed gastro-analyzer]" on ''Ludeon forums''.</ref>}}

produces:

Gastro-analyzer is an implant INTO the nose, while aesthetic nose REPLACES the nose. You can't install a gastro analyzer into a aesthetic nose; it's one or the other.

— Tynan Sylvester,  "Cannot replace destroyed gastro-analyzer" on Ludeon forums.</ref>

2. I see a problem on Character Types#Mechanoids but don't know how to solve it. I've never encountered the syntax " {{: " before, it seems to call a page as a template, but here only the top "{{quote}}" template is displayed. A solution would be to copy the template from Mechanoid to Character Types#Mechanoids and remove the "large" parameter, but I don't know what result was intended in the first place.

Can you have a look at these?

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

{{: is how you call a page in the main namespace for transclusion as if it were a template. It looks like Mechanoids has it set to onlyinclude the quote for some reason and so thats all of the page that gets transcluded. Likely it at one point included more from the page, and later edits have damaged the intended transcluded section. I'll take a look at what it used to include, but honestly, we can probably get rid of the transclusion and change it up for a short summary anyway.

I'll get back to you on the Template:Quote issue. Ty for the reports.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Right, the issue with the quote paramter is the = sign in the link. Without specifying the parameter it assumes you're trying to set a parameter called "[https://ludeon.com/forums/index.php?topic" to a value of "51123.msg474313#msg474313 Cannot replace destroyed gastro-analyzer]" on Ludeon forums.</ref>"

Obviously, there is no parameter called that anywhere in the template, and because its trying to set a parameter its obviously not a unnamed parameter either, so it ignores it.

Serves me right for not sanitizing my inputs. Not sure how to fix it as yet, will look into it.

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Hahaha actually no, apparently that quote is all thats ever been transcluded. I have no idea why such a pointless transclusion was made. Removing it now.

Also looks like there is no way to sanitize the input without changing what the user puts in in the first place, its a problem intrinsic to the wiki format. So we might as well just say "only use = signs when naming a parameter"

Sorry for the reply spam.

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

"the = sign in the link"

Damn, I forgot to check that... XP

I don't think that a fix is possible with templates (it has to be done with lua modules I guess).

A solution would be to replace the "=" by &#61;, or to create a template similar to template:!!, but that would be overkill as one just need to use the parameter...

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

>but that would be overkill as one just need to use the parameter

Agreed, especially given it already requires the editors to change their behavior. Might as well change the behavior to the simpler one.

Also just to borrow this thread, I'd guess you're making mass edits with an external tool? You've taken out the spaces in a lot of headings while fixing the capitalization. e.g. "Version History" -> "Versionhistory". nbd and I'm fixing them now, but just something to check next time.

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

oh $#!7.... I try to always double check.

Leave it to me, I'm correcting this right now

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Seriously don't stress. Mistakes happen.

That said, you also seem to have removed the spaces before several links in this edit, I'm not sure if that happened anywhere else or if its just that page. Might be worth checking jic. Also you lower cased "DLC" there, so if you are doing it automatically, an exception for DPS, DLC, EMP and a few other terms might be in order.

Lastly it looks like you're lower case process broke on ancient mech drop beacon, possibly because the link in question was in a gallery.

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

I'll check all my recent edits, leave it to me for now.

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

It should be good now, thanks for correcting my mess and sorry again for this...

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Infobox descriptions should be as they appear in game, even if they are wrong/grammatically non-standard/poorly structured etc. If there's an actual error in the source itself, like a spelling mistake, tag it with [sic] but otherwise leave it as is in game.

Similarly, for technical reasons, please leave the capitalization on the Stuff Tags. Usage of them generally can automatically account for some being lower case and some upper, but its best to allow it to be fault tolerant.

This isn't a reprimand or anything. Just a request.

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

Understood.

I am currently working on a regex that will match all words with a faulty capitalisation.

In fact, at the moment I am trying to make it able not to match words inside multiline templates (so it will include infoboxes).

Errors in some animals' guard/attack/rescue/haul

11
Summary by Harakoni

Animals should now be up to date

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

Hello Harakoni

On the articles of some animals, like the donkey or the horse, it is stated that they cannot guard, attack, rescue or haul, while in fact they can.

This has an impact on other pages, such as the list of animals.

I guess that the Property:Can_Train_Guard, etc. need to be modified, but I haven't managed to do so.

Is it possible for anyone to do this, and if so, how?

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Yup anyone can update both the pages and the template used to set those variables. On the donkey page in the infobox main template call there will be a line that looks like:

|trainable = none

It can be set to none for none, simple for Can Train Guard and nothing else, intermediate for Can Train Guard and Can Train Attack, and advanced for everything except where its limited by bodysize

It you look in Template:Infobox main and search for Trainable Intelligence it should take you straight to where those relationships are defined.

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

I spawned all the animals in dev mode, checked in Animals tab, and edited the articles that weren't corresponding to what I saw, then I purged the list of animals (I don't know if there are other pages to purge).

Here's my list of what I found, please double-check if possible (I modified the names with a hyphen at the begining of the line):

-alpaca		***
-bison		**
-boomalope	***
-boomrat	***
-capybara	***
-cassowary	***
-cobra		***
-deer		***
-donkey		*****
-horse		*****
-pig		*****
-tortoise	***
-w.boar		***
-warg		*****
a.beaver	***
a.wolf		*****
artic fox	*** *
caribou		***
cat		*
chicken		*
chinchilla	*
cougar	 	 *****
cow		*
donkey		*****
dromad		**
duck		*
eleph		*****
elk		***
emu		***
fennec		*** *
gazelle		***
goat		*
goose		*
grizzly		*****
guinea		*
hare		*
husky		*****
ibex		***
iguana		*
labrador	*****
lynx		***
m.scarab	***
m.sloth		*****
m.spider	*****
monkey		***
muffalo		**
ostrich		***
p.bear		*****
panther		*****
raccoon		***
rat		*
red fox		*** *
rhino		***
s.hare		*
sheep		*
speloped	*****
squirrel	*
t.wolf		*****
thrumbo		*****
turkey		*
yak		*
yorksh		***
Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Are you sure you're on the current version? It looks to me that Alpacas have Trainability None?

unknown.png

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

Oh $#!7...

I remember coming back to an older version because I didn't like some parts of newer ones, and I stayed like this since.

I am up to date now (v1.3.3087) and I saw the difference.

There are still many errors, wouldn't it be easier to centralise this data on a subpage of the template, so each individual article wouldn't have to be modified if important changes like these are made in the future versions? I guess that this wiki is using lua for things like this, so my knowledge in this area isn't good enough to help you with that.

Luckily I could use AutoWikiBrowser (it seems that anyone is even allowed to use auto bot mode), so I corrected my mistakes, and also the other ones.

Here's the pages I edited (with a + in front of the line, first set of asterisks is after my first eroneous edits, second is v1.3.3087):

+artic f	*** *		***
+fennec		*** *		***
+red fox	*** *		***
+warg		*****		***
+alphabeaver	***		*
+alpaca		***		*
+bison		**		*
+boomalope	***		*
+boomrat	***		*
+capybara	***		*
+caribou	***		*
+cassowary	***		*	
+cobra		***		*
+deer		***		*
+donkey		*****		*
+dromadery	**		*
+elk		***		*
+emu		***		*
+gazelle	***		*
+horse		*****		*
+ibex		***		*
+lynx		***		*
+muffalo	**		*
+ostrich	***		*
+pig		*****		*
+raccoon	***		*
+tortoise	***		*
+wildboar	***		*

arctic wolf	*****		*****
cat		*		*
chicken		*		*
chinchilla	*		*
cougar	  	*****		*****
cow		*		*
duck		*		*
elephant	*****		*****
goat		*		*
goose		*		*
grizzly		*****		*****
guinea		*		*
hare		*		*
husky		*****		*****
iguana		*		*
labrador	*****		*****
megascarab	***		***
megasloth	*****		*****
megaspider	*****		*****
monkey		***		***
polar bear	*****		*****
panther		*****		*****
rat		*		*
rhinoceros	***		***
snow hare	*		*
sheep		*		*
spelopede	*****		*****
squirrel	*		*
timber wolf	*****		*****
thrumbo		*****		*****
turkey		*		*
yak		*		*
yorkshire	***		***

I think it is all fine now (I hope ;p ).

Kingerman88 (talkcontribs)

Hello! Not sure if the AutoWikiBrowser actually pushed any updates since I don't see anything in the reversion history and after looking at the pages they seems to not have been reverted. I can probably just revert the pages manually if anything since I'll be working on updating all of the stats (since a lot has changed for 1.3)

(little bit off topic) "I guess that this wiki is using lua for things like this, so my knowledge in this area isn't good enough to help you with that." 👀 really? I actually know a fair bit of lua so I might do some research into that!

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)
Kingerman88 (talkcontribs)

Ah, whoops, I do see those changes. However, actually those animals should have trainability of none (instead of simple). (as the screenshot Harakoni posted earlier) those animals can be tamed but can't be trained. Trainability simple means that the animals can be trained to guard (which as of 1.3 I'm not sure if any animals can only be trained to guard)

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

@Kingerman88: oh, I clearly messed it up again, I put "simple" instead of "none" on the pages I edited...

I'm fixing that right now, thanks.

Kingerman88 (talkcontribs)

All good!

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

It should be fine now, sorry for the trouble.

DarkVector skin and templates/tables

1
Deadgye (talkcontribs)

Many table templates, such as STDT, result in tables that are not easily readable on the DarkVector skin. You often have to highlight the table to be able to read it at all. For the most part, this is because things like background color are explicitly set while text color is not.

Since the DarkVector skin is installed on the site, a mod should be able to edit the css to create overrides for tables and/or templates. As a bandaid fix, I believe simply inverting the background color should be enough to make them contrast with the default skin text colors. The trick should be how to only invert table's background colors when they've been explicitly specified?

SyntaxTerror (talkcontribs)

Hello Harakoni.

Thanks for making changes so I can edit my own user page.

Concerning my talk page, is it possible to make it in "normal" wikicode ? because I sincerely dislike Flow...

Also, are notifications enabled on this wiki? Is there is a template similar to Wikipedia's {{ping}}?

Harakoni (talkcontribs)

Wrt to the talk page, not afaik, though its not something I've looked into. There are still some talk pages that still use normal wikicode, but only pages that have existed for a long time. Likely something grandfathered in.

As for notifications, pretty sure that notifications for whenever your user page is linked to are on by default, though they can be toggled on and off according to your preference as well. I'll test it and you can see if you get a notification.